Podcast

Building Your Audience & Growing Sales Through Social Media with Paul Brown

Paul Brown – Baked Bean Media

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Name: Paul Brown

LinkedIn Profile: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/paulbrownbakedbeanmedia

Company Name: Baked Bean Media

Company Website: https://bakedbeanmedia.com/

Short Bio:

Paul Brown is a Cleveland Browns vlogger, CEO at Baked Bean Media, and owner, founder & host of The Paul Brown Podcast. Paul made the transition from a 360 recruiter to a fully-fledged (social) media pro bringing in in excess of £800,000 of leads for his business up to where he is now working alongside the likes of Anthony Joshua on their social media efforts.

Show Notes

On this episode of The Full Stack Business Podcast I’m speaking with Paul Brown, CEO of Baked Bean Media, a social media and video production company that work with lots of big name clients in the entertainment, sports and corporate spaces.

We had a really good conversation about how to use social media as part of a sales strategy, but more importantly than that, how to be authentic on social media and how to grow an audience through authenticity. We touched on a couple of different topics around personal brand and how that can be compared to the brand of your company as well as many other topics and tips around using social media and video to promote what you love in life.

I hope you enjoy the conversation and please let me know if you’ve got any feedback or questions about the show. You can always hit me up at [email protected]

If you enjoy the episode, please take 10 seconds to leave a review on Apple Podcasts or like, share and follow with your favourite podcatcher!

Paul’s LinkedIn: https://uk.linkedin.com/in/paulbrownbakedbeanmedia
Website: https://bakedbeanmedia.com/

Transcription

Sam Wilcox:

Paul Brown of Baked Bean Media. Thanks for joining me on the show, mate. How are you doing today? Are you all right?

Paul Brown:

I’m very good thanks, Sam. How is the sunny North?

Sam Wilcox:

Well, it’s actually sunny, at least a little bit for once. I don’t know how long it’ll last? But yeah, it’s doing all right, man. What about you down in the South there?

Paul Brown:

Well, I’m afraid to say I’ve had a pint of Guinness. I’ve had a Jaeger Bomb. I’ve had a Wetherspoons breakfast. I’m slurring my words here. I’ve met the Mayor of London. And yeah, now ready for this podcast. So thank you very much for your time.

Sam Wilcox:

No, I appreciate it. Likewise, mate. So why don’t you start by telling everybody a little bit about yourself, and a little bit about Baked Bean Media and what you guys do, who you work with? That kind of stuff, because it looks fascinating from what I’ve seen so far.

Paul Brown:

Yeah. Cool. So I’ll try and do this in 30 seconds.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah.

Paul Brown:

My background is as a trained chef. Bought my first house when I was 18. Then went into the property. Then I joined a sales company. 14 years later, started Baked Bean Media. That’s the story in a nutshell. Grew a sales business. I was one of three partners from zero to a hundred people. And then exited that to do my own thing and started Baked Bean Media.

Sam Wilcox:

So when you say, grew a sales business, what does that mean?

Paul Brown:

Yeah, so basically, I joined a recruitment business with zero experience. Learned the basics, and then helped grow that, from a headcount point of view, from a small company to a large company.

Sam Wilcox:

And then you exited that. Did the company sell on? Or what was the situation?

Paul Brown:

You know what? I left the business.

Sam Wilcox:

You left.

Paul Brown:

I left the business. And yeah, then just started Baked Bean Media.

Sam Wilcox:

Why did you make the switch then? How come you jumped over to Baked Bean Media? What was it that made you think, “This is time for me to get out of here, and I want to get into this thing over here.”

Paul Brown:

The truth is, it was 50% pushed, 50% left.

Sam Wilcox:

Fair enough.

Paul Brown:

I was at the stage of my career, where the big buzz word at the moment is authentic, not a lot of people like speaking about the word authentic. But I was part of a corporate organization. They wanted me to be corporate, and I disagreed. I said, “It’s better to be yourself than try and be a high-end corporate person.”

Sam Wilcox:

Just conflicts there then, yeah?

Paul Brown:

Yeah. There’s a bit of conflict. And as you know, like a bit of conflict. But I was really happy. They wanted to bring me back as a freelancer. So there’s no bad blood. But it was just that, I wanted to be more real. And it was 50/50. I either stayed, or I went. I had some massive shares in the company. So yeah, it was just tough. And I decided to do Baked Bean Media. Went for happiness over money.

Sam Wilcox:

I like it. Tell us about Baked Bean Media then. What do you guys do exactly?

Paul Brown:

Very quickly.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah.

Paul Brown:

Very quickly, we do two things. We do social media marketing. We create videos for people. We’ve worked with people like Anthony Joshua, BMW, Mini, Sky TV.

Sam Wilcox:

Nice.

Paul Brown:

Just short, fun videos. And then I like helping people on LinkedIn for free. I recommend people creating their own content on LinkedIn and social media for free, and maybe getting us in to do some professional work if you need something a bit special for your website, or training, or something a little bit different. But yeah, I’m all for teaching people for free. Just get on social media, create some videos yourself.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah. So I came across you on LinkedIn. We connected on LinkedIn initially to start this conversation off. And I noticed straight away that you were doing something very different than anybody else I’d seen on LinkedIn, which was we connected, and you sent me a video straight away, probably within about two hours, I think.

Paul Brown:

Yeah. Sam, don’t tell everyone this because I normally get a day off once a week and I just do them all.

Sam Wilcox:

Right. Okay.

Paul Brown:

So please don’t expect to get a message in two hours.

Sam Wilcox:

That’s all good. I probably just caught you at the right time then, right? But let’s talk about that because the theme of this first series of the podcast is all about sales, right? Now, I’m not saying that you did that to make a sale, but that has an impact, from a business standpoint, in helping you stand out and grow in that relationship. What’s your theory on social media growth, video content, sales? Do you have any general strategy around that you try and stick to, or what’s the plan for you guys to attract new business?

Paul Brown:

Yeah, I think I try and strip it back to real life and think two things. Number one, what do I like getting? And number two, how real can I make this?

Sam Wilcox:

What do you mean by that? What do you mean by, what do I like getting?

Paul Brown:

So, yeah. So do I enjoy getting spam emails? Do I enjoy getting cold DM, LinkedIn messages? Do I enjoy getting posts through the door? I do actually enjoy getting posts through the door. So part of my strategy is a post strategy. Believe it or not. So anything that makes me happy or excites me. And someone sent me a video message, first of all.

And I thought to myself, “I like this. I’m going to implement it.” So I’m afraid to say it’s not an original idea, but that’s the way my brain works . If I like something, then I try and repeat it. So if I’m at a pub and someone starts talking to me, I like that. And I like meeting people in pubs. So my sales process is to try and get people to the pub to go for a drink together.

Sam Wilcox:

Get them.

Paul Brown:

Yeah, there’s no BS in this. I would be happy doing all my business in a pub with people I like. So, why would I not try to do that? I’d go to the pub with some people. They’re fun. They’re probably a bit too lively for me. I don’t do business with them, but I still like them as a person. So yeah, that’s where my sales process comes down through is trying to be as real as possible.

I like birthday messages. So I always try to send someone a birthday message. So yeah, just trying to keep it real, the sales process, and staying away from anything that’s automated. Now, I think that’s a real tough one in this day and age because everyone wants the whole world to be automated.

Sam Wilcox:

Absolutely.

Paul Brown:

Chat bots. So yeah, the more I can do… In an ideal world, I would like the process to be onto my WhatsApp. Never send an email ever again. And meet face-to-face. That is my ideal process, but I respect that some clients will have to email me and will speak to me on email.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah. It’s interesting because that’s such an opposite to where everybody’s trying to go right now, which makes you stand out a lot more than everybody else. I think the point is really thinking about what you like to receive. Because everybody sends these cold DM, LinkedIn messages. And hands up, I’ve done it as well. I’ve been-

Paul Brown:

Me too.

Sam Wilcox:

We’ve all done that. We’ve all done it. We’ve all been there. It doesn’t work. Let’s face it. We all know it doesn’t work.

Paul Brown:

I disagree. You can get lucky. I could send a cold DM to every one of my connections, and one person may just need a video that day and I could get a sale. And that’s, I think, what they’re doing.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah. It’s a spray-and-pray mentality. Yeah. Fair enough. You might get lucky with one, but I don’t think it’s sustainable… Well the reason why people do that is because they want something that is repeatable over time and they want it to be like, “Okay, well I know if I send 10 messages, I’m going to get X amount back.” And that’s what I mean when I tell you it doesn’t work. I don’t think that works. I don’t think you can build a system out of it. I mean, especially now that LinkedIn has implemented this 100 connection requests limit as well per week.

Paul Brown:

Oh, it’s 100 per week?

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah.

Paul Brown:

I just got banned from sending connection requests last week.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah, there you go. So there’s a limit on that now, right? So there’s a limit to your spray-and-pray approach, which is interesting. But we digress down that strategy a little bit there. But so from your guys’ perspective, you’re just trying to be authentic and build relationships through video and just get people on the phone as fast as possible. By the sounds of things, is that right? Or?

Paul Brown:

Yes and no, because I don’t think to myself every morning, “I need to make 10 calls.” I know it’d be good for business if I do 10 Zoom calls a day. But yeah, my goal every morning is to get the content out there. So whatever that content is, get it out there.

Sam Wilcox:

So do most of your leads come to you then, because content strategy is basically inbound, right? So you’re putting as much content out there as possible to get as much reach as possible, so that you generate more inbound leads. Is that the deal?

Paul Brown:

Yes. Spot on. But I’m also fully aware that I need to grow my audience.

Sam Wilcox:

Right.

Paul Brown:

So, for example, if I’m targeting marketing companies that need help with their content, I may spend dedicated time looking at them, commenting on their posts, trying to build rapport with them. There is that side of the business development that I do.

Sam Wilcox:

Okay.

Paul Brown:

A lot of people say that, and I’m very aware of this. To grow my business I have to grow my audience, and I have to target the growth of my audience. I can’t just have cheerleaders, “Paul, you’re great.” I need to have decision makers that are also seeing my content. So I have to spend a lot of my time trying to get decision makers to see my content and get in contact, hopefully. Get them down to a pub. That’s kind of… I always say two drinks. I buy one, you buy the second. It’s very 50/50.

If you want to do business with me in the future, that’s cool. If you don’t, that’s cool. No stress. But at least we’ve met in a pub and it’s better than trying to do a call together. Or the other thing I do is try to help people. And I would much prefer to waste my time, I’m not going to say waste, I prefer to spend my time not wasting my time with cold calls, but actually spending my time teaching people and helping people. So to do that, I’d much prefer to offer someone 30 minutes of my time for free versus then trying to cold call them, 10 people in half an hour.

Sam Wilcox:

Right. So let’s talk about, because this has come up a couple of times already in the conversation, the word authentic. So when you wake up in the morning, it sounds to me like your main focus is on getting the content. Right? We spoke a little bit just before we actually hit the record button here about your weekend activities and your experience in journalism and stuff like that. So it sounds like you are very content-focused. And we can clearly see that by looking at your social media as well. What’s going through your head first thing in the morning then in terms of authenticity?

Paul Brown:

So classically, I’ve got enough content to always keep me going for a day, which sounds bizarre, but maybe I’ll cook something the night before, that’s… Let me break it down to you first of all.

Sam Wilcox:

Sure.

Paul Brown:

I’m always thinking Paul Brown and Baked Bean Media are two different entities, to be really clear.

Sam Wilcox:

Okay.

Paul Brown:

And Paul Brown thinks of three things for content ideas. London updates, American football, and food. So, I’m always thinking

Sam Wilcox:

So that’s your personal brand. They’re your three-

Paul Brown:

My personal.

Sam Wilcox:

Things that you talk about.

Paul Brown:

Yeah. I don’t think… Baked Bean Media, which is client work, what we get up to, the culture, and the added value. But I’ll be really honest with you, Baked Bean Media manages that.

Sam Wilcox:

Right.

Paul Brown:

So we’ve got a company of six people. They manage that, obviously with my input. And then I share whatever Baked Bean Media is doing. So, to really stress that, I don’t really talk about Baked Bean Media online that much. People are there, but I kind of push that to one side. If people want to add value, they can follow Baked Bean Media. And then I keep Paul Brown as my own personal brand.

Now, when I wake up in the morning, what I’m thinking about is, what’s hot news. What’s trending news? And so yeah, today, the pub’s inside and you could travel. So last night I had a choice of two things. I could either go to an airport, or wake up super early and go to a pub. I chose to wake up super early, go to the pub. Now, I genuinely enjoy pubs. Always have. I’m not an alcoholic, but one or two drinks I enjoy. I’ve now got a fascination of Wetherspoons breakfast. I’m a foodie. Doesn’t make sense why I like Wetherspoons breakfast, but it does what it says on the tin.

Sam Wilcox:

You can’t complain with a Wetherspoons breakfast.

Paul Brown:

No.

Sam Wilcox:

The value is not to be sniffed at.

Paul Brown:

Yeah, exactly. So, and paying 20 pound for a breakfast sometimes I think it’s OTT. But yeah, so in my brain, I’m waking up. Normally I’m trying to predict the news before it happens and I want to have the content before the news needs it. That’s kind of how my brain tries to think. And today is a content-heavy day because the whole world is looking at London and the UK. If I could have got to an airport, it would have been good for me to get to an airport, but I’m not flying. So I’m not going to take that risk.

But yeah, that’s the way my brain’s thinking. And then tomorrow, I could either talk about what happened last night, or go to a restaurant for the first time. Or I could start moving on to some food that I’ve cooked. Or maybe I can just open up Twitter Trending. That’s one of my top tips.

Sam Wilcox:

Right.

Paul Brown:

I use Twitter Trending, or find out what is actually going on in the world. And then you’ll see the news producing that information maybe six hours later on.

Sam Wilcox:

So once you find this information, and then obviously you’re thinking, “Okay, how can I create some content around this that’s engaging?” What types of content and how often are you creating here? Is it one post a day? Is it short videos? Are you doing videos and image posts? Is it a whole mixture of everything? Just as much as you can physically get and just stick it all out there, or…?

Paul Brown:

Yeah, so there’s the balance of obviously filming for people. There’s obviously the balance of sending out birthday messages, business development, looking for new clients, talking to people. So, I’m not there a hundred percent of the day just producing content. But what I am thinking is, “Okay, let’s post something. Let’s see how that does for the day?” And then I may go out for lunch and I may see someone get arrested on Oxford Street and I may film it. Post it. Or I may see a Rolls-Royce painted pink and I may film that. Just interesting bit of content. So I do shoot from the hip. And once again, it goes back to that mindset of, if my brain finds it interesting, I will potentially post it.

Sam Wilcox:

Interesting. So here’s something I want to ask you about because it seems like you’re very, like you say, shoot from the hip, spontaneous. You’ll whip the camera out, you’ll record anything. You’ve got no fear when it comes to getting in front of the camera, obviously. I think I was looking at your LinkedIn before and I saw a picture of you in a Great British, Union Jack underpants with a tiger in, was it, Piccadilly Square is it?

Paul Brown:

No, it was Buckingham Palace.

Sam Wilcox:

Buckingham Palace. Buckingham Palace.

Paul Brown:

There’s a story behind that, really quickly. It was Christmas Day.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah. Yeah, please.

Paul Brown:

Christmas Day. I was home alone, and I just thought to myself, “My family’s 300 miles away, my daughter’s a hundred miles away. I’m on my own. I wonder how many other people are in the same situation as me?” Instead of moping around feeling sorry for myself, I thought, “Sod it. I’m going to go out, do something funny. At least it’ll put a smile on people’s faces.” So that’s where it came from.

So I picked up a six-foot tiger, some tinsel. And yeah, I went down to Buckingham Palace. 10 o’clock, believe it or not, on Christmas Day, it was rammed. I put the tiger down, took my dressing gown off, basically, got a bit of applause. Got worried about the police. Took a picture. Short video, and then away I go again. So yeah, that’s me in a nutshell. But I’ll be honest, I would like to do more fun, more controversial humor, but I don’t do enough of it. And yeah, that’s something I definitely want to evolve into in the future.

Sam Wilcox:

I think what you do though, it’s like the perfect strategy for the business that kind of sits in the background from your personal brand to a degree. Because you’re building your own personal brand through social media by filming anything and everything that’s interesting to you. But all the while you all head-to-toe in Baked Bean Media gear, right?

And like you say, you’re always going to be cross posting Baked Bean Media stuff. So as your audience grows through the Paul Brown personal brand, naturally, people are just going to see that growth and then also think, “Well, maybe he can do this for us. Oh, he’s got this company over here as a secondary thing.” Does that work really well because it’s easier to grow a personal brand than it is a business brand do you think? Or what’s your thoughts on that?

Paul Brown:

To answer your question. Yes, it is easier to build a personal brand. Look at Richard Branson, for example, Elon Musk.

Sam Wilcox:

Right.

Paul Brown:

I think a lot of them, if you look at major clients, that’s more… Maybe not Apple. Quickly Google it and find out CEO of Apple versus Apple’s Instagram. But yeah, I think secretly, people buy into the CEO more than the company these days and age. So yeah, I think that’s a really good point. And I think it’s just stripping it down, being real with yourself about what actually interests you. And when I work with the new client, I say, “Here’s an iPad. On the weekend, what’s the first thing you look at?” And people will go, “Oh, I check my LinkedIn.” I’m like, “Come on mate, it’s a Saturday. Honestly, what are you going to check? Is it going to be your fancy football score? Is it going to be the Daily Mail? Where’s your favorite DJ playing this weekend?”

Whatever it is, if you’ve got a passion for that. Talk about it, report about it, document about that. If you want to. Creating content, you don’t have to do it. I’ve got my boundaries. I don’t include my family. I’m not fully naked, even though you may disagree. And I normally keep my friends out of it, to be honest. So a lot of people think I haven’t got a lot of friends. But I just don’t want to go out with my mates and feel like they have to be part of my content if that makes sense?

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah. You don’t want to put them in a position where they feel like, “Oh, is Paul going to be utilizing this moment for some social media content?”.

Paul Brown:

Yeah. Don’t get me wrong. They will absolutely destroy me when they see about stuff I’m posting and give me loads of banter. But yeah, there’s a time and a place. And I do… A lot of people don’t think this either. I have massive periods where I switched off from social media. I will classically go from Saturday evening till Sunday evening without posting anything, really just chilling out, whatever. So, but to answer your question you asked me earlier is, I look to post a video a day across all platforms.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah.

Paul Brown:

And then TikTok, for example, I’m looking to post four videos a day.

Sam Wilcox:

Why is that?

Paul Brown:

I think it’s probably the most optimum to post. I think if you want to grow a TikTok account to do it, you post every two hours.

Sam Wilcox:

Okay.

Paul Brown:

I would say 8:00 till 8:00, or 6:00 till 8:00 at night, you could get away with posting a video every two hours and you will see growth, but then you sit in this place where you become a social media whore, if you don’t mind me saying it?

Sam Wilcox:

Go for it.

Paul Brown:

Just producing a lot just to get the fame or to grow

Sam Wilcox:

Likes.

Paul Brown:

Accounts. So I think four a day. I think LinkedIn, I want to be posting a video a day and four posts a day throughout the day. But once again, if I ever don’t post four times a day I’m never angry, or never upset, or… It is what it is.

Sam Wilcox:

I think when you say these numbers, a lot of people instantly, me included in this. I’m including myself here. I think, “Fucking hell, that’s a lot.”

Paul Brown:

Yeah.

Sam Wilcox:

That’s a lot of effort. Which I’m sure it is. So how-

Paul Brown:

Do you know what? I flip it around and say, “I think I can do a post in one minute, two minutes.” You can just literally go on Twitter Trending, and you can just talk about what’s your thoughts on Johnny Depp getting arrested? A question. Post it. Or whatever’s related to you. So I want to stress out that I shoot from the hip. I’m not a copywriter expert. I literally sometimes just write down what I’m thinking out loud, and then push post. And my videos are classically 10 seconds long. 10 to 30 seconds. I will very rarely post any more than that, unless it’s a YouTube video.

Sam Wilcox:

Right. And how do you feel about podcasts and stuff as a format? Because-

Paul Brown:

Brilliant.

Sam Wilcox:

These are longer forms. Is this something that you do? I know you have your American football show. I imagine that’s part of that.

Paul Brown:

Yeah. So I do American football every single day. And to get into the U.S. market my strategy was literally to do a 15 minute podcast every day about the news on the Cleveland Browns, which is an American football team. So it’s a bit like, how to be the number one Crewe Alexandra podcast? It’s quite simple. Produce content every day, post it on social media as soon as you create it. Have an opinion, have a view. Probably, having an opinion is my biggest weakness. I know how to ask controversial questions, but I’m not very good at saying, this is my opinion. So if you take some extremes, for example, of Kate Hopkins or…

Sam Wilcox:

Piers Morgan.

Paul Brown:

Yeah, exactly. They do very well because they have an opinion. People love their opinion. People hate their opinion. And they generate algorithm heavens because people are commenting, getting emotionally attached to their posts, and their posts will go a lot better. Obviously, they’ve got the audience as well. But being opinionated on social media is definitely an advantage. And it’s something that I’m not too good at.

Sam Wilcox:

But you’re good at asking those controversial questions. I know that because I’ve seen it. I’ve seen it on LinkedIn.

Paul Brown:

Yeah, exactly. As we said before the show, I’m always looking for three things in a video. And it’s so simple. And it’s even a six second video, I’ll still look for the same. What’s going on? Conflict. And an outcome. Even if you haven’t got outcomes, suspense is great because they can watch another video.

Sam Wilcox:

Right.

Paul Brown:

But I’m looking for these three things in a video all the time. So what is the situation? Oh my God, did that just happen? Wow. That’s what I’m looking for in every video.

Sam Wilcox:

Right. Right, right. Super interesting stuff, mate. I admire your creativity, your spontaneity, and your willingness to just get it done and get it out. I think a lot of people struggle with that. I think that’s something that holds a lot of people back because they overthink things too much and maybe they’re too much of a perfectionist about it. Whereas you’re just like, “Look, this is me. This is what I like. I’m going to record this. I’m going to get it out there. And who cares what anybody says? Any conversation is better than none. And I’m moving on to the next thing in two hours.”

Paul Brown:

Yeah, exactly. So I think you summed it up really well that maybe I’m not the best at replying to all my comments. Trolls, for example. I get trolls, I don’t even bother applying to them.

Sam Wilcox:

Well, I suppose you’re right.

Paul Brown:

Yeah. “I’m going to smash your head in with a phone next time I see you in London.”

Sam Wilcox:

Okay.

Paul Brown:

Okay, cool. Like, “You got 12 followers, and if you can’t have a decent conversation with me, I’m not going to lose any sleep over it.” So, but yeah. So yeah, I think trolls play a big part. I think probably the biggest thing that people say to me is, “Paul, I want to do what you’re doing, but I’m scared of what my clients are going to think.”

Sam Wilcox:

Right.

Paul Brown:

“I’m scared that people think I’m too much of a clown. People want to see me talking about business.” Where, I respect that and you don’t all have to have the same mentality as myself. But I think people would remember you if they knew more about you and there was that, “Oh, Paul’s from Cornwall. Sam’s from Crewe.” You know?

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah.

Paul Brown:

Or, “Next time I’m in London, I’m going to meet Paul for a beer. I know I’m going to meet poor for a beer he’s not going to sell to me.” So, once again, it goes back to that first thing I said is, treat people how you want to be treated. I don’t want to be sold to. If I meet you for a beer, I’m not going to sell it to you. You either need my services one day, or you don’t. I’m here to help. You can WhatsApp me. Imagine that you have a problem with your TV.

You got to phone Curry’s. You’re like, “Jesus Christ. I just want to know how to put my TV on.” Versus if you could just WhatsApp the head of Curry’s and go, “Mate, my TV’s not working.” And he goes, “Oh, have you switched it on?” “Oh, shit. No.” The relationship I want with clients is like, “I’m filming a video today.” “Well have you turned the lights on?” “Oh know, I haven’t thought about lighting.” In an ideal world, that’s how I want it all to be in my life. Just clients WhatsApping me for quick questions. And I help them out free of charge. And maybe one day they need a video for the website and then we can charge them.

Sam Wilcox:

I like it, mate. Well, on that note, I’m conscious of your time. I know you’ve got a busy day today. So let’s wrap this one up, mate. I think in terms of the things I took away from this is, try and be yourself and talk about whatever you can that is interesting to you. It doesn’t have to be polished. Just getting stuff out there and starting a conversation is better than doing nothing. And there’s also something I need to think about after this, which is how the personal brand of the CEO relates to the business? And how, and when those things should be separated? Or if they should be separated? I think it depends on what you want, right? So there’s definitely some interesting stuff to think about around that as well. But yeah, I really appreciate your time today.

Paul Brown:

Just one thing.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah?

Paul Brown:

One thing real quickly is… audience. Watch and listen to your audience. I’ll give you an example. I think I’m great at cooking. I get great responses on Instagram. On TikTok I just can’t get any love with my TikToK cooking. So you’ve got a choice, you either keep doing what you’re really passionate about, or you follow your audience. And there’s no right or wrong there. But yeah, if you do want to grow your account and more people prefer to see someone getting arrested versus a lovely Beef Wellington, then I’m afraid to say, you should-

Sam Wilcox:

You’re getting down to the pub on a Saturday night.

Paul Brown:

Yeah, exactly. The ideal situation would be someone, a policeman throwing a Beef Wellington into a… But no. Yeah, jokes aside. It’s very important that you understand that there’s cheerleaders, which will help algorithms and support you. But then there’s your passion as well. Sometimes, you may be… EDM, or whatever you’re really into, you may be producing content after content. The real good content, in depth, is just getting nowhere. So sometimes, maybe follow what your audience wants, or sell it, just do what you believe in and just keep creating more and more content.

Sam Wilcox:

Well, the theory is, if you create the content that you’re passionate about then, and you manage to… I suppose, if you try to grow your audience with, let’s say you take a half-and-half approach, right? Where you’re doing half of the stuff that you’re passionate about, half of the stuff that your audience wants and you’re getting responses from. The theory is, if you can grow and get more response from 50% of that, then over time as that audience grows, there’s a small portion of that that will resonate with your more authentic stuff that you’re posting on there as well, right?

Paul Brown:

Yeah, correct. And remember, all it takes is one client to buy from you, and that’s all that matters. It doesn’t matter about getting one or 2 million views on a video. If your client’s seeing it, that’s all that matters.

Sam Wilcox:

Yeah. Nice one, mate. I appreciate your time. Thanks for coming on the show.

Paul Brown:

No worries.

Sam Wilcox:

And I’ll let you get back to shaking hands with politicians.

Paul Brown:

Uh, sorry. We didn’t shake hands due to the COVID regulation.

Sam Wilcox:

Okay, that’s very true. Cheers, Paul.

Paul Brown:

Take care, Sam. Thanks a lot for your time.

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